Just pulled the trigger on an IR Patrol

Louis Richards

LSB Member
Getting a little irritated at IR defense. Still waiting on a manual that never came with the unit, as well as a battery extender that was ordered with the unit.

I'm guessing this company is much smaller than originally thought. I would think this is as simple as putting it in a box and mailing it. But that just doesn't seem to be the case as excuse after excuse is followed by week after week.
 

wigwamitus

LSB Active Member
IR-Defense doesn't have downloadable manuals!!?? Who, knew !?
:)
I'm lucky, Armasight, Pulsar and ATN all have downloadable manuals! Whew!!
 

Louis Richards

LSB Member
LMAO! That was funny stuff :) yes, I don't need the manual now, but it would've come in handy the first couple days. Now I just await it for the principle of the matter. LOL

I like you wig, assumed it would be downloadable. At this point I just want it, so when I get ready to sell it...

Peter is at the shot show, and IR refuses to dropship directly to customers, only dealers. Of course, everyone at IR is at the shot show too!

I should just have had them bring it and hand it to Pete manually
 

wigwamitus

LSB Active Member
IR refuses to dropship directly to customers, only dealers.
Interesting, I call Armasight for an "accessory" and they ship directly to me and charge Aaron. Then Aaron/Joe square up later.
Different business process!

And I called Armasight just this Tuesday with two problems and got a new guy Rogine Alejo who fixed both of my problems!!! Armasight customer service has improved significantly in quality over the past 2 years.

Called ATN yesterday, they were "at lunch" no call back yet.

Sent email query to Lithuania for pulsar tech support question Tuesday, no response yet. In the mean time, I solved the issue myself.

So far this week, Armasight wins the customer Sat competition!!! :)
 
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JPK

LSB Active Member
You all do know that no manual comes with the unit, right? Only the flip through guide, which, as Brian wrote, is more than adequate.

JPK
 

Louis Richards

LSB Member
Yes, I am aware it's a flip type QuickStart. As I say, it's the principle at this point. As well as my battery extender.

Been doing tons of research and was oh so hoping I could use a 18650 rechargeable in place of the 2- 123's. When all the chat is said and done, and all the experts have weighed in, the basic answer is no.

However, it appears that they can be used, but that you shouldn't run them over 50%, for fear of fire, blah blah blah. The truth of the matter, is the 18650 has come a long ways and has built-in circuitry that prevents it from doing such things nowadays. Still, I understand IR defenses concerns about them. Probably not worth risking on the $6000 piece of equipment.

It was just that, I personally would still risk it. But there's other issues as well.

Evidently, the unit can take up to 3–123 A's. Or 10 volts. A voltage regulator is built-in that keeps it around 3.3

123's fully discharged around 4 and you need to keep around .3 extra head above for the regulator to work.

The 18650's discharge way below that, falling below 3.6 or the extra head need it. What I cannot seem to get an answer on, is when it discharges below 3.3, does the unit simply shut off, which just means put in a new battery, or does the voltage regulator fail, possibly causing damage to the unit?

All in all, probably just safer not to use them :)

Update: it's very cold outside tonight, and I had the misfortune of a thief in the neighborhood that broke in a lot of trucks. Luckily, he just stuck to stealing the exterior lights off of my front winch mount! Others did not fare so well..

But I've been going out every 30 minutes with my patrol and oh my god what a beautiful, crisp clear picture. Just like you see in the videos :)))

I am a very very very happy man.
 
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JPK

LSB Active Member
If you want to run a rechargeable battery, you can use the ULtimate Night Vision rechargable battery pack. I use one with my MK II and it works great.

The Patrol will take one CR 123A as it comes from IR, it will take two with the battery extender installed.

An easy answer to keeping 123A's on hand is to buy them in bulk from batteryjunction.com or a similar on line, discount reseller.

ETA: with the Patrol, when battery power is below about 1/3 as indicated via the on screen meter, the Patrol starts acting up. For example, horizontal lines appear in mine and sometimes the unit will shut down, but allow a re-start. Best to just change the batteries out. Also, IR told me that start up battery drain is high enough that it is likely more efficient to leave it on all of the time you are out with it, depending on frequency of viewing through it.

JPK
 
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Louis Richards

LSB Member
Brian, even though I don't have it yet, it should fit with the battery extender that allows two. Well JPK, I find that information eye opening, that the start up requires so much energy that it's best to leave it on all the time. Of course, there would be dozens of variables to factor in. Are you leaving it on for the duration of the battery usage? Are you turning it on and off two dozen times in the course of an hour? Things like that.

Still, if what they're saying is turning it on and off every five minutes the entire night versus leaving it alone I would probably agree with that.

I am a prepper, batteries not an issue. In fact, I think batteries are one of the most neglected, if not the most neglected item for storage. Amazing how people have tons of food water bullets guns, yet not enough ample batteries.

I carry several hundred double a, couple hundred D's, couple hundred 123's, hundred aaa and very few c and very few 9 V. But have a crap load, maybe 30, 18650 for all my flashlights. I'm a Fenix nut. They all take 18650. The couple hunfred 123's are just for backup case there was no place to recharge the 18650. Still, now that I have both night vision goggles and the patrol that take them, glad I stocked up!

Now that I experienced the clarity of the patrol, think I have finally, and this doesn't come easy to decide, to make it my one and only main scope for both day and night. But honestly, it sure is difficult for me to drop my 3 x 12 optical scope. It truly is. But seeing as I get diminished results using it as a clip on, or so I've been told I do not know firsthand, and I don't want to have to re-zero the unit swapping back-and-forth, I've decided just to keep it on there.

I'm sure it's going to take a lot of use getting used to it. A LOT. Just curious, how many others out there are using it as their main primary every day scope?
 

Brian Shaffer

Hog Hunter
SUS VENATOR CLUB
LoneStarBoars Supporter
Louis, are you sure? The girth of the 18650 battery is larger than that of a CR123. IIRC, the CR123s are a pretty exact fit in IRD products. I don't believe the 18650 will fit in the hole, hence why I suggested the 16650 which is the same girth as a CR123.
 

wigwamitus

LSB Active Member
Since about November I've been using Q-14 primarily as night sight (it doesn't "scope" much at 1x) for rat slaying and it is perfect for that. At distances between 1yd and 60yds ... shooting at hand to thumb sized targets it works as a rifle mounted spotter and a sight. And it has retained zero on both .22LR and 5.56(14.5).
But thermal won't be optimal under all conditions. During the day, depending on angle of sun, I get too much glare. I can cup my hand over the gap between eye piece and eye, but I can't do that and shoot. I can use other material as a cover and that works.
Also with the snow on the ground, i2 works much better for spotting and shooting as the terrain tends to wash out more with the thermal (it is all closer to similar temperature. And this is even more true in the rain.
Bottom line I wouldn't want to depend on only thermal. I'm moving to dedicated day and night rifles - two of each. With option to put i2 on the day rifles.
Having a mixture of day optics, i2 and thermal allows good spanning of all the various conditions I face on the land around me.
 

JPK

LSB Active Member
Louis,

I would suggest using the QD Patrol D-LOC weapon mount and a QD Bobro or Larue one piece scope mount for your day optic. My experience, and that of many others, is that a top quality QD mount like the D-LOC, Larue, Bobro, will return to zero, as they are designed to.

JPK
 

Wildfowler

Mis'sippi
SUS VENATOR CLUB
Louis, are you sure? The girth of the 18650 battery is larger than that of a CR123. IIRC, the CR123s are a pretty exact fit in IRD products. I don't believe the 18650 will fit in the hole, hence why I suggested the 16650 which is the same girth as a CR123.


I just checked my Mark 2 Hunter and an 18650 will not fit in the housing.
 

Brian Shaffer

Hog Hunter
SUS VENATOR CLUB
LoneStarBoars Supporter
Thanks for verifying for me guys. I don't currently have an MKII or Patrol on hand. So the 18650 on board issue is moot, short of using a hammer, which would be exceptionally unsafe to do.
 

Louis Richards

LSB Member
Brian, my bad, your statement was a bit vague, and you werent specific in regards to what you meant by "wont fit." I thought you meant in regards to length. Which is why I replied it should with the extender.

Unfortunately, I lumped you into the vast majority of people that are absolutely clueless about batteries and things like that. Evidently, you're not one of them :) I have no idea how much you know about batteries, especially since this is not really the forum for such things.

In theory, 18650's are 18mm. 123a 16mm. In the real world however, they fluctuate greatly, not by much, but they still fluctuate. So the majority of them have a larger diameter than 18. Again, not by much, but still larger. Could just be the casings and labels that give them a wider diameter. I have nothing but Fenix, and all Fenix are 18.5 as an example.

I have yet to find out what the actual diameter of the battery housing is with the patrol. It's one of those things I just need to call to find out and that call is buried last on my priority list, because it's just an FYI thing as I know I have no intentions of trying to use it.

But normally and as a rule of thumb, there is enough clearance in 123a housings to fit 18650's without any issue, unless it is an exact fit. And if it's an exact fit, that's normally because the manufacture designed it to specifically be so, as the 18650 will damage whatever it was being used in.

Seeing as how I could almost toss in my 123's into the patrol, I already knew there was latitude there, so I just assumed it would, as the 123a freely and easily fits in the housing, with respectable play left over.

Add in the ongoing debates / confusion / questions on many sites concerning the usage of the 18650 for the Patrol concerning "voltage", I could only have ASSUMED they fit, if not, then why all the talk about voltage, voltage regulators, discharge rate, blah blah blah, if the freaking things don't even fit in the unit to begin with!!! What a useless endever that is.

So not knowing what the actual dimensions were, combined with knowing I had spare room left over, combined with all the discussions already in play about whether they can be used with the battery extender, YES I ASSUMED.

Without even checking, as I already knew I was never going to risk it anyway, so why bother teasing myself by staring at that beautiful battery begging to be capped and used.

And once again, no matter how many times I have learned the "Assume Lesson" it still comes to plague and haunt me...

Once again though, I cannot even imagine why so many sites have threads concerning the uses of them, if come to find out now, they don't even fit to begin with. That will baffle me for sometime to come...

Want to know the funny thing Brian? I read your last post and said to myself "Geez, of COURSE they will fit Brian, but let me go actually do it to prove it to Brian... Then I read the other post saying they had and it didn't fit and my damn face turn red!

JPK, I just went through this internal battle with myself, convincing me that in daytime use the patrol would be just as useful as nighttime use, to identify potentially hidden targets. And I just concluded the matter with myself. To open that door again, with your probably excellent advice, it's too much for me at this moment :)

Plus I already invested 350 bucks to be able to detach the patrol and with the same mount, put the unit directly on my helmet and vice versa.
 

Brian Shaffer

Hog Hunter
SUS VENATOR CLUB
LoneStarBoars Supporter
Oh man, I would hate to be considered in the category of people clueless about batteries, especially when it came to the understanding that batteries so obviously different in size as the 18650 and CR123 are not just unidimensionally different. That would be embarrassing. :)
 
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