Practicing with Night Vision
- Thread starter wigwamitus
- Start date
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
Oops didn't see BRD's last "CALL MANUFACTURER" before I went out (and proceeded).
I assume that would be the ammunition manufacturer?
I usually keep them, but because it has been 8 months since I opened that last box of the old batch of BH77, I can't find the box, so don't know the batch/lot #.
==
The good news is I fired 15 rds of the new batch of BH77 out of each of the 5.56(14.5) and the 5.56(18) and no issues. That was at 100yds. The 5.56(14.5) 15rds were grouped around the bull, about an inch low. The 15rds from the 5.56(18) were grouped 2 inches left and 1 inch low, so I cranked 4 clicks left and 2 clicks up (these are MOA clicks on these L&S 3.5-10x TMR turrets). Then went to 200yds and held 1 mil up and hit 12 inch steel (almost buried in bushes) with 5rds of FLC 55gr. All these were standing with stick. The 5rds were a bit high (these rds make holes in this steel at that range) so I only needed to hold 0.5 mil up. Holes were centered.
So it appears those older BH77 rounds did have an issue. They have been out of the box sitting on the shelf with primers facing up for 8 months. So dust probably got on them. Maybe I should've wiped them first?
But as of now, tentative diagnosis is something happened to those primers while sitting out on the shelf for 8 months. The new BH77gr and FLC55gr ammo seems to work fine in the "new to me" 5.56(18).
I'm happy that we seem to have ruled out "broke gun" !!!
Thanks everyone for your comments and support!!!
I assume that would be the ammunition manufacturer?
I usually keep them, but because it has been 8 months since I opened that last box of the old batch of BH77, I can't find the box, so don't know the batch/lot #.
==
The good news is I fired 15 rds of the new batch of BH77 out of each of the 5.56(14.5) and the 5.56(18) and no issues. That was at 100yds. The 5.56(14.5) 15rds were grouped around the bull, about an inch low. The 15rds from the 5.56(18) were grouped 2 inches left and 1 inch low, so I cranked 4 clicks left and 2 clicks up (these are MOA clicks on these L&S 3.5-10x TMR turrets). Then went to 200yds and held 1 mil up and hit 12 inch steel (almost buried in bushes) with 5rds of FLC 55gr. All these were standing with stick. The 5rds were a bit high (these rds make holes in this steel at that range) so I only needed to hold 0.5 mil up. Holes were centered.
So it appears those older BH77 rounds did have an issue. They have been out of the box sitting on the shelf with primers facing up for 8 months. So dust probably got on them. Maybe I should've wiped them first?
But as of now, tentative diagnosis is something happened to those primers while sitting out on the shelf for 8 months. The new BH77gr and FLC55gr ammo seems to work fine in the "new to me" 5.56(18).
I'm happy that we seem to have ruled out "broke gun" !!!
Thanks everyone for your comments and support!!!
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
2015-08-15
0830-1000
80F
05 MPH S
Goal: 5.56(18) out to 500yds.
Environment: Warm, clear, turning hot, wind from 180 to 210 off bullet path.
Equipment: 5.56(18), stick, BH77, L&S 3.5-10x TMR, LRF.
Activity: All shots standing with stick.
G01 - 2rds - 100yds - 10+10 avg 10 - a little high and left, but both rounds went in the same hole.
No adjustment
G02 - 2rds - 200yds - 9+9 avg 9
I called one shot left centered and the other centered low, so that seemed to match the results.
LRF was 204yds. AB said to hold 0.5 mils, but I did not as I was already high (maybe) and this was an elevation shot.
G03 - 2rds - 300yds - 10+9 avg 9.5
I called right and dead on. AB said to hold 1.3 mils, I held one mil, I was still high on avg. I tried to use the classic KSE words "aim at the center of the wobble". Wind was 5 MPH at 210 off bullet path, but I did not hold for wind, figuring the shooter would be the prime variable.
LRF said 297
G04 - 2rds - 400yds - 10+8 avg 8
Called right and center, which worked out. AB said to hold 2.5 and I did this time as I thought the elevation was flatting out at this FP.
LRF said 400, 399, 400
G05 - 2rds - 500yds, 7+9 avg 8
called center and low center, but was very high. AB said to hold 3.9, I held 3.5 but was still high. At this FP I am about 1300 feet above sea level and the target is at about 1200.
LRF was 496.
Results: I need to factor in the elevation to the AB calculations. I set the MV to 2700 so might need to adjust that also. Fluid aiming technique probably needs to be adjusted for longer distances. I usually start low and move cross hairs up, this could result in high shots as the barrel is still moving up when trigger is pulled. Need to crest the upward movement and fire just as barrel starts back down and our more fully embrace the "aim at the center of the wobble" technique. For shorter distances shooting the aim at the crest of the rise works fine, but at longer distances, this might cause me to be high.
This is a large target, NRA 500yd target, it is 3 feet from side to side of the paper, though to miss even for me! I'm not sure what this target is really used for, but for my purpose today it was fine.
Equipment issue, the barrel and the DD rails are not aligned, so if I add the CO-LR in front I would expect to be off to the right by a significant amount. I will try it first, but I think I will need to go back to gs and see if they can do a better job of aligning. When they swapped the muzzle devices I did not make a point of reminding them to align the rails and the barrel.
Ammo issue: No ammo issue today, no stopages everything worked fine.
The grass is high. The tops go from about stomach height up to eyebrow on avg with a few over my head. The main grass blades are between knee high and thigh high. This makes moving in the grass tough. Here is view from 500yd FP. Green line points to NRA 500yd target, white dot to the left of the NRA 500yd target is 16 inch steel.
0830-1000
80F
05 MPH S
Goal: 5.56(18) out to 500yds.
Environment: Warm, clear, turning hot, wind from 180 to 210 off bullet path.
Equipment: 5.56(18), stick, BH77, L&S 3.5-10x TMR, LRF.
Activity: All shots standing with stick.
G01 - 2rds - 100yds - 10+10 avg 10 - a little high and left, but both rounds went in the same hole.
No adjustment
G02 - 2rds - 200yds - 9+9 avg 9
I called one shot left centered and the other centered low, so that seemed to match the results.
LRF was 204yds. AB said to hold 0.5 mils, but I did not as I was already high (maybe) and this was an elevation shot.
G03 - 2rds - 300yds - 10+9 avg 9.5
I called right and dead on. AB said to hold 1.3 mils, I held one mil, I was still high on avg. I tried to use the classic KSE words "aim at the center of the wobble". Wind was 5 MPH at 210 off bullet path, but I did not hold for wind, figuring the shooter would be the prime variable.
LRF said 297
G04 - 2rds - 400yds - 10+8 avg 8
Called right and center, which worked out. AB said to hold 2.5 and I did this time as I thought the elevation was flatting out at this FP.
LRF said 400, 399, 400
G05 - 2rds - 500yds, 7+9 avg 8
called center and low center, but was very high. AB said to hold 3.9, I held 3.5 but was still high. At this FP I am about 1300 feet above sea level and the target is at about 1200.
LRF was 496.
Results: I need to factor in the elevation to the AB calculations. I set the MV to 2700 so might need to adjust that also. Fluid aiming technique probably needs to be adjusted for longer distances. I usually start low and move cross hairs up, this could result in high shots as the barrel is still moving up when trigger is pulled. Need to crest the upward movement and fire just as barrel starts back down and our more fully embrace the "aim at the center of the wobble" technique. For shorter distances shooting the aim at the crest of the rise works fine, but at longer distances, this might cause me to be high.
This is a large target, NRA 500yd target, it is 3 feet from side to side of the paper, though to miss even for me! I'm not sure what this target is really used for, but for my purpose today it was fine.
Equipment issue, the barrel and the DD rails are not aligned, so if I add the CO-LR in front I would expect to be off to the right by a significant amount. I will try it first, but I think I will need to go back to gs and see if they can do a better job of aligning. When they swapped the muzzle devices I did not make a point of reminding them to align the rails and the barrel.
Ammo issue: No ammo issue today, no stopages everything worked fine.
The grass is high. The tops go from about stomach height up to eyebrow on avg with a few over my head. The main grass blades are between knee high and thigh high. This makes moving in the grass tough. Here is view from 500yd FP. Green line points to NRA 500yd target, white dot to the left of the NRA 500yd target is 16 inch steel.
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
2015-08-19
2130-2330
65F
5-8 MPH NW
Goal: Observation drive
Environment: Wind from the NW, overcast, rain off and on.
Equipment: PVS-14 on helmet, Apollo on lanyard around neck as monocular, 4-wheeler.
Activity: Rolled around property doing mounted perimeter check and critter observation.
On North side of creek, saw six turkeys in usual area near alfalfa patch. Saw rabbit in NE brome patch, I was able to get within 50yds even with noisey 4-wheeler.
Stream between prairie hay patch and NE brome patch has really pooled up and the water level is over the running board of the 4-wheeler.
Crossed main ford, had to deviate through woods off trail due to fallen tree.
In main Southern pasture, saw 5 deer at 300yds nera crest of hill 1309. They would not let me get closer than 300yds. I have gotten to within 100yds with the 4-wheeler but not tonight. Saw another rabbit in the West side of Southern pasture and counted 20 cows in neighbors pasture to the South (there are supposed to be 34, but they are not all always visible). Returning to house area saw a squirrel in the wood shed, it ran up onto the rafters so I couldn't "see" it. Critters don't assume we have thermal.
Results/Summary: I sat still in each pasture to do 360s to see what I could see. Thermal performance was decent, given the rain and moisture in the air. Batteries died about half way through the jaunt, so Aaron's c123 pouches came in handy. I had put 2 sure fires in one of the pouches and attached it to the back of the helmet just before going out. I removed the dead batteries and placed in pocket, then removed the new batteries from the helmet and placed in thermal and I was back in business. That's the way it is supposed to work!
I will keep looking at "silencers" for the 4-wheeler as it seems noisier than the buggy and hence alerts the critters at longer distances.
==
Otherwise, I've been shooting the 5.56(18) off the stick at 500yds quite a bit ... hitting the 9 ring (1 moa) about 3 out of 4 ... in winds usually about 5-10 MPH ... 55gr ammo has less elevation variation due to higher MV, but 77gr has less windage variation due to heavier bullet.
I hold 3.5 mil up for the 77gr off 100yd zero for the 77gr and 2.5 mil up for the 55gr off 100yd zero at 500yds.
For wind I hold 1.8 mils for crossing 10 mph with the 55gr and 1.0 mil for the 77gr.
Shooting standing up at 500yds is a new experience for me. Next I need to try at night ... and also unsupported without the stick. I had a guy tell me he could hit running (at 40mph) antelop at 500yds standing unsupported ... I still struggle to believe it ... but time will tell if wilkerbutt can even dream about it ...
2130-2330
65F
5-8 MPH NW
Goal: Observation drive
Environment: Wind from the NW, overcast, rain off and on.
Equipment: PVS-14 on helmet, Apollo on lanyard around neck as monocular, 4-wheeler.
Activity: Rolled around property doing mounted perimeter check and critter observation.
On North side of creek, saw six turkeys in usual area near alfalfa patch. Saw rabbit in NE brome patch, I was able to get within 50yds even with noisey 4-wheeler.
Stream between prairie hay patch and NE brome patch has really pooled up and the water level is over the running board of the 4-wheeler.
Crossed main ford, had to deviate through woods off trail due to fallen tree.
In main Southern pasture, saw 5 deer at 300yds nera crest of hill 1309. They would not let me get closer than 300yds. I have gotten to within 100yds with the 4-wheeler but not tonight. Saw another rabbit in the West side of Southern pasture and counted 20 cows in neighbors pasture to the South (there are supposed to be 34, but they are not all always visible). Returning to house area saw a squirrel in the wood shed, it ran up onto the rafters so I couldn't "see" it. Critters don't assume we have thermal.
Results/Summary: I sat still in each pasture to do 360s to see what I could see. Thermal performance was decent, given the rain and moisture in the air. Batteries died about half way through the jaunt, so Aaron's c123 pouches came in handy. I had put 2 sure fires in one of the pouches and attached it to the back of the helmet just before going out. I removed the dead batteries and placed in pocket, then removed the new batteries from the helmet and placed in thermal and I was back in business. That's the way it is supposed to work!
I will keep looking at "silencers" for the 4-wheeler as it seems noisier than the buggy and hence alerts the critters at longer distances.
==
Otherwise, I've been shooting the 5.56(18) off the stick at 500yds quite a bit ... hitting the 9 ring (1 moa) about 3 out of 4 ... in winds usually about 5-10 MPH ... 55gr ammo has less elevation variation due to higher MV, but 77gr has less windage variation due to heavier bullet.
I hold 3.5 mil up for the 77gr off 100yd zero for the 77gr and 2.5 mil up for the 55gr off 100yd zero at 500yds.
For wind I hold 1.8 mils for crossing 10 mph with the 55gr and 1.0 mil for the 77gr.
Shooting standing up at 500yds is a new experience for me. Next I need to try at night ... and also unsupported without the stick. I had a guy tell me he could hit running (at 40mph) antelop at 500yds standing unsupported ... I still struggle to believe it ... but time will tell if wilkerbutt can even dream about it ...
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
a
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
2015-08-23
2100-2230
50F
05 MPH W
Goals: 5.56(14.5) with laser from 4-wheeler out to 150yds.
Environment: I wore light overshirt as it is unseasonably cool. In fact it has been much cooler at night lately. This is good as it reduces the "muggy/buggy" syndrome. Moon was 50% lite up and during the tine I was out was high in the sky. Sky had a fair amount of clouds in it, but some starts were leaking through.
Equipment: 5.56(14.5), vickers sling, eotech, eotect 3x magnifier, steiner CQBL-1 ir-laser on 3 o'clock, IR-20 ir-illuminator on 6 o'clock, SPW5.56 on front, FLC 55gr, Canteen, LRF, 30-lumen RGBW light, PVS-14 3x magnifier, 3 magazine pouch, .45ACP with CT grip ir-laser. Team Wendy helmet with PVS-14, batteries and .45ACP mag as counter-weight. In pockets were usual gloves(wore one on left hand), pocket knife, 300L taclight, 3L RGBW admin light and piece of 5.56 brass for turning CQBL knobs.
Activity: Remained mounted the whole time, targets setup previously. The goal was to try to practice with the CQBL laser out to 150yds shooting from the 4-wheeler. I had tried to co-witness the visible laser out to 30yds from the back porch during the day.
Shooting first 2 rd group at 30yds, I was low and right. Crank half a turn up and half a turn left. Second group was a tiny bit right but centered vertically, so went to 50yds. At 50yds I was more right but good vertically, so cranked a quarter turn up and second group was good. At 30yds and 50yds I was shooting down the buggy trail, so I good fire from sitting position on the 4-wheeler, but at 100yds I had to stand up to see over the grass and be able to make out the top half of the target. I had to use the illuminator on the helmet in order to see the target. The T-20 was too powerful at this close range and washed out the ir-laser. But the T-20 added some useful extra weight up front.
So the first 2rd group at 100yds was low but centered and I had to do a mag change. I cranked up a half turn. That was too much and for second group at 100yds I cranked back down half way. That was still a little high, but I wanted to be a little high at 100yds, like about 2 inches high. Then I went to several other firing positions around the pasture to see if I could see steel at 200yds or 150yds ... I have 3 steel targets setup in 2 different spots. But I could not see any of them with or without the T-20, with or without the PVS-14 3x magnifier, they were too far into the bushes. So I had to return to the paper target, which I could see fro 150yds without the illuminators, though I did have to use the 3x magnifier slipped on to the front of the 14. The 150rd group was good a 2 MOA group on the POA, again, I had to stand up on the 4-wheeler to be able to see/shoot over the high grass.
Results/Summary: Once I get new thermals, I will no longer have a thermal clipon, so want to work harder on practicing with laser. Not all rifles will have thermals, those that don't will use laser for night hunting. My i2 clipons are too heavy for standing unsupported shooting.
I rode out with the suppressor in the pouch on belt, that helps with the weight balance when carrying the rifle strapped on while driving the 4 wheeler. I have an AAC mini in the oven, that will help more, shorter and lighter. Otherwise all the gear worked. And the sequence of strapping everything on was good. I was able to drink from the canteen and reach the LRF and the 3x magnifier and the suppressor pouch and change magazines, so everything was accessible without disruption.
I need more counter-weight on this helmet. If I try to put the second PVS-14 on the dual mount, there is too much weight up front. I have never moved the big counter-weight group over from the OPS Core helmet I wear in the winter.
2100-2230
50F
05 MPH W
Goals: 5.56(14.5) with laser from 4-wheeler out to 150yds.
Environment: I wore light overshirt as it is unseasonably cool. In fact it has been much cooler at night lately. This is good as it reduces the "muggy/buggy" syndrome. Moon was 50% lite up and during the tine I was out was high in the sky. Sky had a fair amount of clouds in it, but some starts were leaking through.
Equipment: 5.56(14.5), vickers sling, eotech, eotect 3x magnifier, steiner CQBL-1 ir-laser on 3 o'clock, IR-20 ir-illuminator on 6 o'clock, SPW5.56 on front, FLC 55gr, Canteen, LRF, 30-lumen RGBW light, PVS-14 3x magnifier, 3 magazine pouch, .45ACP with CT grip ir-laser. Team Wendy helmet with PVS-14, batteries and .45ACP mag as counter-weight. In pockets were usual gloves(wore one on left hand), pocket knife, 300L taclight, 3L RGBW admin light and piece of 5.56 brass for turning CQBL knobs.
Activity: Remained mounted the whole time, targets setup previously. The goal was to try to practice with the CQBL laser out to 150yds shooting from the 4-wheeler. I had tried to co-witness the visible laser out to 30yds from the back porch during the day.
Shooting first 2 rd group at 30yds, I was low and right. Crank half a turn up and half a turn left. Second group was a tiny bit right but centered vertically, so went to 50yds. At 50yds I was more right but good vertically, so cranked a quarter turn up and second group was good. At 30yds and 50yds I was shooting down the buggy trail, so I good fire from sitting position on the 4-wheeler, but at 100yds I had to stand up to see over the grass and be able to make out the top half of the target. I had to use the illuminator on the helmet in order to see the target. The T-20 was too powerful at this close range and washed out the ir-laser. But the T-20 added some useful extra weight up front.
So the first 2rd group at 100yds was low but centered and I had to do a mag change. I cranked up a half turn. That was too much and for second group at 100yds I cranked back down half way. That was still a little high, but I wanted to be a little high at 100yds, like about 2 inches high. Then I went to several other firing positions around the pasture to see if I could see steel at 200yds or 150yds ... I have 3 steel targets setup in 2 different spots. But I could not see any of them with or without the T-20, with or without the PVS-14 3x magnifier, they were too far into the bushes. So I had to return to the paper target, which I could see fro 150yds without the illuminators, though I did have to use the 3x magnifier slipped on to the front of the 14. The 150rd group was good a 2 MOA group on the POA, again, I had to stand up on the 4-wheeler to be able to see/shoot over the high grass.
Results/Summary: Once I get new thermals, I will no longer have a thermal clipon, so want to work harder on practicing with laser. Not all rifles will have thermals, those that don't will use laser for night hunting. My i2 clipons are too heavy for standing unsupported shooting.
I rode out with the suppressor in the pouch on belt, that helps with the weight balance when carrying the rifle strapped on while driving the 4 wheeler. I have an AAC mini in the oven, that will help more, shorter and lighter. Otherwise all the gear worked. And the sequence of strapping everything on was good. I was able to drink from the canteen and reach the LRF and the 3x magnifier and the suppressor pouch and change magazines, so everything was accessible without disruption.
I need more counter-weight on this helmet. If I try to put the second PVS-14 on the dual mount, there is too much weight up front. I have never moved the big counter-weight group over from the OPS Core helmet I wear in the winter.
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
2015-08-24
2100-2200
50F
03 MPH W
Goals: 5.56(18) at 500yds.
Environment: Moon getting more full, still some overcast up in the sky, so some stars obscured. Light breeze from 300 off bullet path.
Equipment: 5.56(18), FLC xm193 55gr, stick, LRF, canteen, .45ACP, L&S 3.5-10x (10x) TMR Ill Ret, CO-LR (L-3), 3x PVS-14 magnifier, PVS-14 on Helmet, ir-ill on helment, 3L RGBW on helmet, 300L in pocket, 3L RGBW in pocket. SPW 5.56
Activity: Fired 5rd group at 500yds standing off stick, could only see top half of target due to height of grass. Held 2.5 mils up as I had been doing in the day. Group center 5 inches left 2 inches high. Score 10+7+7+7+6 avg 7.4. I was worried that the rail was off center and I think it is affecting accuracy. So I will have to take it back to smith to see if they can get it back on straight. They had to take it off to swap the muzzle devices (to get the barrel vice on).
2100-2200
50F
03 MPH W
Goals: 5.56(18) at 500yds.
Environment: Moon getting more full, still some overcast up in the sky, so some stars obscured. Light breeze from 300 off bullet path.
Equipment: 5.56(18), FLC xm193 55gr, stick, LRF, canteen, .45ACP, L&S 3.5-10x (10x) TMR Ill Ret, CO-LR (L-3), 3x PVS-14 magnifier, PVS-14 on Helmet, ir-ill on helment, 3L RGBW on helmet, 300L in pocket, 3L RGBW in pocket. SPW 5.56
Activity: Fired 5rd group at 500yds standing off stick, could only see top half of target due to height of grass. Held 2.5 mils up as I had been doing in the day. Group center 5 inches left 2 inches high. Score 10+7+7+7+6 avg 7.4. I was worried that the rail was off center and I think it is affecting accuracy. So I will have to take it back to smith to see if they can get it back on straight. They had to take it off to swap the muzzle devices (to get the barrel vice on).
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
Equipment from last night ...
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
2015-08-25
1330-1415
70F
03 MPH SW
Goal: 5.56(18) 500yds, want to make sure scope is still align with the barrel at 500yds!
Environment: Warm and clear.
Equipment: 5.56(18), FLC xm193 55gr, stick, L&S 3.5-10x (10x) TMR, SPW5.56
Activity: Fired 5rd group at 500yds standing with stick. Score 10+9+8+7+6 avg 8. Windage alignment was good, variation was in the verticle, which I assume is my wobble. I am trying to aim at the center of the wobble (thx, KSE!).
1330-1415
70F
03 MPH SW
Goal: 5.56(18) 500yds, want to make sure scope is still align with the barrel at 500yds!
Environment: Warm and clear.
Equipment: 5.56(18), FLC xm193 55gr, stick, L&S 3.5-10x (10x) TMR, SPW5.56
Activity: Fired 5rd group at 500yds standing with stick. Score 10+9+8+7+6 avg 8. Windage alignment was good, variation was in the verticle, which I assume is my wobble. I am trying to aim at the center of the wobble (thx, KSE!).
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
2015-08-26
2200-2330
60F
03 MPH SW
Goal: 5.56(18) at 500yds.
Environment: Approaching full moon, stars visible. Light breeze from 270 off bullet path.
Equipment: 5.56(18), FLC 55gr, bipod, SPW556, L&S 3.5-10x (10x) TMR, CO-LR, Helmet, PVS-14, ir-illum on helmet, 3L RGBW light on helmet. .45ACP 1 8+1 in gun, 1x8 on helmet.
(image same as last above for 18 inch rifle and gear - did not use stick tonight - used bipod off roof of buggy standing in bed of buggy)
Activity: To be able to see over the grass, I fired standing from the buggy bed. I put the rifle bag on the roof of the buggy (parked pointed at the target) and put the bipod on the rifle bag - it was wet and slick on top of the buggy.
Fired 14rds 8+8+8+8+7+7+7+7+7+6+5+5+5+5 avg 6.64. I had cranked right 2 clicks (1 MOA =5 inches) as previous shoots with CO-LR where high and left. Now I seemed to be centered but high. So I cranked 4 clicks down (2 MOA = 10 inches). I held 2.5 up at 500yds as I have been doing. I missed the center of the wobble a few times. For the second group, I shorted the stock, only 2 clicks of extension instead of three. This seemed to allow a better pocket to form. So difference betwtween first group and second, I focused harder on the position.
Fired 4rds 10+10+10+9 = 9.75. So, until I can get the rail adjusted my offset is 4 down and 2 right when the co-lr is mounted and 2 left and 4 up when it is removed. Held 2.5 up.
Fired 5rds at steel at 200yds, held 1 mil up. Got 5 clangs (hits).
Brought camera this time, so I could take target pic. These target boards are large and I don't bring them back and forth each time like I have been doing the smaller ones, hence we've missed some target pics. I should be taking the camera anyway, it is my BC.
Getting the Bobro mount should also help. At this point, the CO-lR mount is either too loose (flops around on the rail) or too tight (can't close latches). I go with too tight as at least I'm not flopping. But I have to check it a lot to make sure it hasn't come loose, since I can't lock down the latches. I've been told the Bobro mounts are "on the way". Need one for thermal also. The bobro is supposed to "auto size" itself to the various NearSpec rails.
2200-2330
60F
03 MPH SW
Goal: 5.56(18) at 500yds.
Environment: Approaching full moon, stars visible. Light breeze from 270 off bullet path.
Equipment: 5.56(18), FLC 55gr, bipod, SPW556, L&S 3.5-10x (10x) TMR, CO-LR, Helmet, PVS-14, ir-illum on helmet, 3L RGBW light on helmet. .45ACP 1 8+1 in gun, 1x8 on helmet.
(image same as last above for 18 inch rifle and gear - did not use stick tonight - used bipod off roof of buggy standing in bed of buggy)
Activity: To be able to see over the grass, I fired standing from the buggy bed. I put the rifle bag on the roof of the buggy (parked pointed at the target) and put the bipod on the rifle bag - it was wet and slick on top of the buggy.
Fired 14rds 8+8+8+8+7+7+7+7+7+6+5+5+5+5 avg 6.64. I had cranked right 2 clicks (1 MOA =5 inches) as previous shoots with CO-LR where high and left. Now I seemed to be centered but high. So I cranked 4 clicks down (2 MOA = 10 inches). I held 2.5 up at 500yds as I have been doing. I missed the center of the wobble a few times. For the second group, I shorted the stock, only 2 clicks of extension instead of three. This seemed to allow a better pocket to form. So difference betwtween first group and second, I focused harder on the position.
Fired 4rds 10+10+10+9 = 9.75. So, until I can get the rail adjusted my offset is 4 down and 2 right when the co-lr is mounted and 2 left and 4 up when it is removed. Held 2.5 up.
Fired 5rds at steel at 200yds, held 1 mil up. Got 5 clangs (hits).
Brought camera this time, so I could take target pic. These target boards are large and I don't bring them back and forth each time like I have been doing the smaller ones, hence we've missed some target pics. I should be taking the camera anyway, it is my BC.
Getting the Bobro mount should also help. At this point, the CO-lR mount is either too loose (flops around on the rail) or too tight (can't close latches). I go with too tight as at least I'm not flopping. But I have to check it a lot to make sure it hasn't come loose, since I can't lock down the latches. I've been told the Bobro mounts are "on the way". Need one for thermal also. The bobro is supposed to "auto size" itself to the various NearSpec rails.
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
Thanks!
==
2015-08-30
2130-2300
60F
00 MPH NE
Goals: Mounted observation and ir-laser at 100yds.
Environment: Full moon rising in the East, blinding me as I roll over One Tree Hill. I had to reach up and turn down the gain. Clouds obscure most star formations, but B. Dipper visible.
Equipment: 4-wheeler, light about 98% out (some emerges from the cover I placed over the "driver information panel"). 5.56(14.5) with vickers sling, SPW556, FLC xm193, eotech and 3x magnifier (neither portion of eotech was used), CQBL-1 and 1 mag with 14+1, T-20 ir illum(not used). PVS-14, 720nm filter on front, Lopro eye wear. Integrated Components D-14 Dual Mount, Norotos TATM Mount, Team Wendy Helmet, ATN B-450 IR-Illum on left side of helmet, Gerber 3 lumen RBGW admin light on right side of helmet, 1 mag .45ACP with 7rds on back of helmet, 1 helmet pouch with 8xAA batteries on back of helmet, 1 helmet pouch with 2xc123(ten). 1 9 volt for strobe(no strobe carried tonight). On belt, Bushnell ARC Elite 1600 LRF, USGI 3x magnifier for PVS-14, 30 lumen RBGW light. On separate straps 3 mag pouch with 2 mags 5.56 55gr with 15rds each and canteen. .45acp on in serpa holster on separate pistol belt. In pockets, pocket knife, 1000 lumen white light, 3 lumen RBGW admin light (none used). Left glove in left pocket, right glove in right pocket (neither used).
Activity: Rolled up to top of signal (one tree) hill and did a couple of 360s ... saw cows 600yds to the South, confirmed distances with 3x 14 magnifier and LRF to be 550-800yds.
Rolled across pond dam and up about 50yds NW of hill 1309. With no wind, I am very loud, would not expect to see critters in these conditions, moon light and no wind suppressing the sound.
Fired 5 rounds from 100yds, this was at old berm and 100yds (actually 108yds) is a known distance FP. The moon light was very bright, but I could find the 12 inch steel target quickly because it reflected in the water. I fired at the real one above the reflection. I had to stand up on the 4-wheeler to be able to see over the grass. The grass and weeds were high along this low ground and I had to aim through a gap. I did not use the 3x magnifier for shooting. I got five hits. Hitting the steel, they were loud, I thought 1 of them was bouncing back at me (I've heard of that happening - though that was with xm855 62gr). I'm not used to hearing it so loud, but with no wind and with shooting with laser closer in than usual, it is loud.
Then rolled North across the main ford. This time of year the spiders are very aggressive in terms of extending their webs out into paths. I guess this is the last hurrah before they "button up" for the winter. And some of them are big. I usually have 1-2 on me when I return. I didn't tonight, but I think I flicked one off out there. I bumped into a bunch.
In the Alfalfa patch, I ran some Turkey's out of a tree (inadvertantly) but that is normal, they seem to like the alfalfa patch although not as much as they did before the new dog to the North of us arrived a couple of months ago. Now I see 3s and 6s ... those kinds of numbers ... haven't seen a 60, 80, 100 count group over there this year.
Then rolled through each of the North side "Patches", Alfalfa, Brome#1, Prairie and Brome#2. Heard cows to the NE, there are about 10 on that land on about 80 acres.
Then back across the main ford (have to detour around through the woods due to a downed tree). Back up to the top of hill 1309, back across the pond dam, back to the top of signal hill for another 360, then back across Turtle creek I stopped at the vehicle building and saw stationary rabbit at 10yds. Resumed rolling and it ran off.
Then did vehicle building checks (power and water) and then put the tractor to bed (removed stack and reversed in to the vehicle building). Then RTB.
Summary/Results: First cleaned the lopro eye wear tonight, then let it dry, then rubbed on some of the Fog Tech. The lopro goggles did not fog tonight. They are a bit fuzzy sometimes, though they cleared up some after about 10m in the field. Bugs, rocks, mud, leaves, branches, lots of things tap me in the head and in the face in particular. Having the LoPro eye wear on when rolling on the 4-wheeler at night might not turn out to be a good idea, but I'm trying it. They are vented on the two sides - a bit - though there is a trade off in dusty situations between fogging and dust in eyes. But the dust is reduced with eyePro on. I wear eye pro (usually) when mowing and when I don't my eyes get full of "dust".
The ir-laser worked. The PVS-14 worked. The 4-wheeler worked. Oh and I was able to hold the rifle so that it did not bump into the 4-wheeler at any point. This is the first time that is true. I did have the suppressor on the whole time.
Waiting for new thermal - any day now !
==
2015-08-30
2130-2300
60F
00 MPH NE
Goals: Mounted observation and ir-laser at 100yds.
Environment: Full moon rising in the East, blinding me as I roll over One Tree Hill. I had to reach up and turn down the gain. Clouds obscure most star formations, but B. Dipper visible.
Equipment: 4-wheeler, light about 98% out (some emerges from the cover I placed over the "driver information panel"). 5.56(14.5) with vickers sling, SPW556, FLC xm193, eotech and 3x magnifier (neither portion of eotech was used), CQBL-1 and 1 mag with 14+1, T-20 ir illum(not used). PVS-14, 720nm filter on front, Lopro eye wear. Integrated Components D-14 Dual Mount, Norotos TATM Mount, Team Wendy Helmet, ATN B-450 IR-Illum on left side of helmet, Gerber 3 lumen RBGW admin light on right side of helmet, 1 mag .45ACP with 7rds on back of helmet, 1 helmet pouch with 8xAA batteries on back of helmet, 1 helmet pouch with 2xc123(ten). 1 9 volt for strobe(no strobe carried tonight). On belt, Bushnell ARC Elite 1600 LRF, USGI 3x magnifier for PVS-14, 30 lumen RBGW light. On separate straps 3 mag pouch with 2 mags 5.56 55gr with 15rds each and canteen. .45acp on in serpa holster on separate pistol belt. In pockets, pocket knife, 1000 lumen white light, 3 lumen RBGW admin light (none used). Left glove in left pocket, right glove in right pocket (neither used).
Activity: Rolled up to top of signal (one tree) hill and did a couple of 360s ... saw cows 600yds to the South, confirmed distances with 3x 14 magnifier and LRF to be 550-800yds.
Rolled across pond dam and up about 50yds NW of hill 1309. With no wind, I am very loud, would not expect to see critters in these conditions, moon light and no wind suppressing the sound.
Fired 5 rounds from 100yds, this was at old berm and 100yds (actually 108yds) is a known distance FP. The moon light was very bright, but I could find the 12 inch steel target quickly because it reflected in the water
. I fired at the real one above the reflection. I had to stand up on the 4-wheeler to be able to see over the grass. The grass and weeds were high along this low ground and I had to aim through a gap. I did not use the 3x magnifier for shooting. I got five hits. Hitting the steel, they were loud, I thought 1 of them was bouncing back at me (I've heard of that happening - though that was with xm855 62gr). I'm not used to hearing it so loud, but with no wind and with shooting with laser closer in than usual, it is loud. Then rolled North across the main ford. This time of year the spiders are very aggressive in terms of extending their webs out into paths. I guess this is the last hurrah before they "button up" for the winter. And some of them are big. I usually have 1-2 on me when I return. I didn't tonight, but I think I flicked one off out there. I bumped into a bunch.
In the Alfalfa patch, I ran some Turkey's out of a tree (inadvertantly) but that is normal, they seem to like the alfalfa patch although not as much as they did before the new dog to the North of us arrived a couple of months ago. Now I see 3s and 6s ... those kinds of numbers ... haven't seen a 60, 80, 100 count group over there this year.
Then rolled through each of the North side "Patches", Alfalfa, Brome#1, Prairie and Brome#2. Heard cows to the NE, there are about 10 on that land on about 80 acres.
Then back across the main ford (have to detour around through the woods due to a downed tree). Back up to the top of hill 1309, back across the pond dam, back to the top of signal hill for another 360, then back across Turtle creek I stopped at the vehicle building and saw stationary rabbit at 10yds. Resumed rolling and it ran off.
Then did vehicle building checks (power and water) and then put the tractor to bed (removed stack and reversed in to the vehicle building). Then RTB.
Summary/Results: First cleaned the lopro eye wear tonight, then let it dry, then rubbed on some of the Fog Tech. The lopro goggles did not fog tonight. They are a bit fuzzy sometimes, though they cleared up some after about 10m in the field. Bugs, rocks, mud, leaves, branches, lots of things tap me in the head and in the face in particular. Having the LoPro eye wear on when rolling on the 4-wheeler at night might not turn out to be a good idea, but I'm trying it. They are vented on the two sides - a bit - though there is a trade off in dusty situations between fogging and dust in eyes. But the dust is reduced with eyePro on. I wear eye pro (usually) when mowing and when I don't my eyes get full of "dust".
The ir-laser worked. The PVS-14 worked. The 4-wheeler worked. Oh and I was able to hold the rifle so that it did not bump into the 4-wheeler at any point. This is the first time that is true. I did have the suppressor on the whole time.
Waiting for new thermal - any day now !
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
New toy Q-14 640(30)
Not sure I can use it like a "clipon" some people say no ... but other people say IR-PATROL can be ... and not sure why they would be different so I will try it. I usually run the pictured VO 1-6x on 3x ...
Q-14 came with weapons mount but not the helmet mount interface needed to actually mount it to the helmet ... so I'm hopefully that will show up one day soon ... my hope is that I can use the q-14 helmet mounted mostly for hands free detection.
We have wife's sister for company this weekend ... and trying to get ready to knock down the rest of the hay next week ... so won't be much time to play in the field over the next week ...
Not sure I can use it like a "clipon" some people say no ... but other people say IR-PATROL can be ... and not sure why they would be different so I will try it. I usually run the pictured VO 1-6x on 3x ...
Q-14 came with weapons mount but not the helmet mount interface needed to actually mount it to the helmet ... so I'm hopefully that will show up one day soon ... my hope is that I can use the q-14 helmet mounted mostly for hands free detection.
We have wife's sister for company this weekend ... and trying to get ready to knock down the rest of the hay next week ... so won't be much time to play in the field over the next week ...
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
2015-09-06
1430-1500
90F
10 MPH SW
Goal: Squirrel
Environment: Hot, sunny, windy.
Equipment: .22LR, sling, VO 1-6x, Eley edge
Archive pic from a week or so ago, but exactly the same config as today.
Activity: Went out to try to zero .22LR with new Q-14 in front of the VO 1-6x. Spotted "The Squirrel" which ate wife's potatoes a few weeks back. I've had my eye on him, but either I didn't have the rifle or he was too fast for me and moved before I could shoot. This squirrel had a very high SA factor!
So today, I saw him heading around the side of a building, so I removed the thermal and peered around the corner. He saw me (that danged high SA factor again) and ran behind a wooden skid, I fired anyway. The bullet went through the skid and nailed him. The wood from the skid added some "shrapnel" to the situation. This was a hecque of a death rattle for a little critter, lots of blood.
Results: I laid him to rest out near the pond for the coyotes. Stalking this guy had been tough, I learned a lot. I learned a split second can make the difference between making a shot and not. I didn't get to zero the .22LR, that will have to wait.
1430-1500
90F
10 MPH SW
Goal: Squirrel
Environment: Hot, sunny, windy.
Equipment: .22LR, sling, VO 1-6x, Eley edge
Archive pic from a week or so ago, but exactly the same config as today.
Activity: Went out to try to zero .22LR with new Q-14 in front of the VO 1-6x. Spotted "The Squirrel" which ate wife's potatoes a few weeks back. I've had my eye on him, but either I didn't have the rifle or he was too fast for me and moved before I could shoot. This squirrel had a very high SA factor!
So today, I saw him heading around the side of a building, so I removed the thermal and peered around the corner. He saw me (that danged high SA factor again) and ran behind a wooden skid, I fired anyway. The bullet went through the skid and nailed him. The wood from the skid added some "shrapnel" to the situation. This was a hecque of a death rattle for a little critter, lots of blood.
Results: I laid him to rest out near the pond for the coyotes. Stalking this guy had been tough, I learned a lot. I learned a split second can make the difference between making a shot and not. I didn't get to zero the .22LR, that will have to wait.
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
2015-09-07
1345-1400
80F
10 MPH S
Goal: Try to zero q-14 in front of VO 1-6x on .22LR.
Environment: It rained this morning and has been overcast the rest of the day so far, which is keeping temp down 10F.
Equipment: .22LR, sling, VO 1-6x, eley edge, q-14 640(30) in front of VO.
Activity: Put medium box over stump (so it wouldn't blow away) carved 2 inch square hole in middle side of box. Sometimes this is visible through the thermal, it wasn't today.
I turned on the thermal reticle (crosshair) and aligned it to the VO crosshair using the boresight buttons. If you head moves in the slightest the two crosshairs are not sitting exactly on top of each other. But by leaving both cross hairs visible, this might provide a consistent result.
Fired 5 rounds, all 5 went in to the 2 inch hole. After removing the box I could see the holes on the stump. Distance was 30yds.
Results/Summary: So while a 2 inch hole is not a tight tolerance, it is tight enough for my purposes, so it does seem possible to use the thermal in front of the VO 1-6x. I had the magnification on 2x ... it was hard to focus on 3x.
1345-1400
80F
10 MPH S
Goal: Try to zero q-14 in front of VO 1-6x on .22LR.
Environment: It rained this morning and has been overcast the rest of the day so far, which is keeping temp down 10F.
Equipment: .22LR, sling, VO 1-6x, eley edge, q-14 640(30) in front of VO.
Activity: Put medium box over stump (so it wouldn't blow away) carved 2 inch square hole in middle side of box. Sometimes this is visible through the thermal, it wasn't today.
I turned on the thermal reticle (crosshair) and aligned it to the VO crosshair using the boresight buttons. If you head moves in the slightest the two crosshairs are not sitting exactly on top of each other. But by leaving both cross hairs visible, this might provide a consistent result.
Fired 5 rounds, all 5 went in to the 2 inch hole. After removing the box I could see the holes on the stump. Distance was 30yds.
Results/Summary: So while a 2 inch hole is not a tight tolerance, it is tight enough for my purposes, so it does seem possible to use the thermal in front of the VO 1-6x. I had the magnification on 2x ... it was hard to focus on 3x.
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
On way back from doing nightly mechanical checks for electric/water plant in our vehicle building last night I had the q-14 with me and in just about 5 min time span three critters.
In side yard saw rabbit at 25yds ... after about 2 mins I clicked a button one too many times and it ran behind our hay shed. I was able to see this rabbit with pvs-14 as it was in an open area.
Then in backyard saw a critter at 40yds that I think was too large to be a squirrel, might have been a skunk or a coon it walked around under some trees in a circle with head down. It had a large tail ... after about a min in headed into the bushes and did not re-emerge. I tried to see this critter with pvs-14 and could not as the critter was too far in the shadows.
Then towards the road I saw a rabbit at 200yds heading away ... it stopped and started several times and I was able to try zooming in ... I could still see it at 2x and 4x but at 8x I just saw a bunch of pixels and couldn't relate them to real world images. I could not see the rabbit with the 14.
In side yard saw rabbit at 25yds ... after about 2 mins I clicked a button one too many times and it ran behind our hay shed. I was able to see this rabbit with pvs-14 as it was in an open area.
Then in backyard saw a critter at 40yds that I think was too large to be a squirrel, might have been a skunk or a coon it walked around under some trees in a circle with head down. It had a large tail ... after about a min in headed into the bushes and did not re-emerge. I tried to see this critter with pvs-14 and could not as the critter was too far in the shadows.
Then towards the road I saw a rabbit at 200yds heading away ... it stopped and started several times and I was able to try zooming in ... I could still see it at 2x and 4x but at 8x I just saw a bunch of pixels and couldn't relate them to real world images. I could not see the rabbit with the 14.
wigwamitus
LSB Active Member
2015-09-06
1515-1530
90F
03 MPH SW
Goal: Rat
Environment: Hot, sunny, light breeze
Equipment: .22LR, sling, VO 1-6x, Eley edge
Same archive pic, same config as today.
Activity: Arrived home from store and saw rat in yard. It stopped near a tree. I went inside loaded .22LR and proceeded back out. To my surprise rat still near same tree. As I stalked up rat headed away, so I had an ass shot at 25yds, I took it. Rat rolled over and legs wiggled a bit.
Results: Unusual to see a rat in the day in the open around here. Haven't done an "ass" shot before ... looks like it really opened this one up along the belly. I say I was a little low, but did enough damage to get a DRT.
1515-1530
90F
03 MPH SW
Goal: Rat
Environment: Hot, sunny, light breeze
Equipment: .22LR, sling, VO 1-6x, Eley edge
Same archive pic, same config as today.
Activity: Arrived home from store and saw rat in yard. It stopped near a tree. I went inside loaded .22LR and proceeded back out. To my surprise rat still near same tree. As I stalked up rat headed away, so I had an ass shot at 25yds, I took it. Rat rolled over and legs wiggled a bit.
Results: Unusual to see a rat in the day in the open around here. Haven't done an "ass" shot before ... looks like it really opened this one up along the belly. I say I was a little low, but did enough damage to get a DRT.
Ratdog68
LSB Official Story Teller
LSB TURKEY BUZZARD PRESERVATION SOCIETY
SUS VENATOR CLUB
LoneStarBoars Supporter
LOL... We have our first winner of the Carpe Mus banner. Didja put a tape on him to measure and do a weight guestimation? Qualifies as a throw rug... or a furry doily with a tail. Nice chootin'
RattlesnakeDan
San Antonio Texas
LSB TURKEY BUZZARD PRESERVATION SOCIETY
SUS VENATOR CLUB
LoneStarBoars Supporter
Texas heart shot on a rascally rat. True trophy....impressive.