Group size with thermal

Discussion in 'Night Vision/Thermal' started by Mattg1500, Jan 7, 2019.

  1. Mattg1500

    Mattg1500 LSB Member

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    How tight of a group do you get with your thermal? I have an Apex XQ50 and group size is larger than when i had my regular scope on the rifle. At 100yds i can put 3 on a hand warmer but not touching like with a regular scope. Just curious.
     
  2. Wray

    Wray LSB Member

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    When I was working up a load of Sierra 110 pro hunters in my 6.8 and xq 50, I quit when I stacked 4 rounds vertically in about an inch. I was shooting at a small hand warmer and using 10.8x.

    I’ve shot it out to 300 and got a 4” group. Sounds like either further load development or different factory ammo is in order if you want to improve on that. The scope is capable.
     
  3. Mattg1500

    Mattg1500 LSB Member

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    Thanks. I just shoot Barnes factory loads but shot 1" at 100 easy with my swarovski. I am not experienced with thermals and wasnt sure if you could fine tune them. Seems like i get larger adjustments than 1/4moa
     
  4. Wray

    Wray LSB Member

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    Can you play with the reticles and find one that might do a better job of framing the handwarmer?
    The handwarmer I was using was about 2"x3" I cant find them now but was thinking it was smaller than 2" across. I taped it long ways vertical, it did make for an aim small situation. I think Todd sells some real small thermal targets.
     
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  5. Fla_dogman

    Fla_dogman LSB Member

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    I'm getting the same result. With a day scope I can get moa with the thermal at least double that. To make things worse the adjustments must be 1" per click. I've come to the conclusion they are not a precision shooting instrument. Minute of hog clique seems to be real
     
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  6. Wildfowler

    Wildfowler Mis'sippi SUS VENATOR CLUB

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    Try a smaller hand warmer.

    I use ones they call toe warmers and fold them in half and staple them to a target.
     
  7. Jhop

    Jhop LSB Active Member SUS VENATOR CLUB

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    I use a 2 inch piece of folded aluminum foil. Stands out pretty good and doesn't give the heat bleed over from the heat that hand or foot warmers do. When I think I'm on target I use the cross hairs to shoot at the very corner of the foil. I square up two sides of the cross hairs on the edge of the foil. Much more exact that way.
     
  8. pruhdlr

    pruhdlr Cantonment,Fla. SUS VENATOR CLUB

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    When I first got my thermal I used the very small warming packets. They are actually designed to put inside your boots. They are rectangular and about (~) 1.5X2".
    My older ThOR will put a bullet in them every shot at 50yds. The pic is of my last two varify zero shots. One on the left was first,adjusted crosshair to the right one "click",then the final.
    These were out of a 10.5" ,6.8 AR pistol shooting factory Hornady 120gr SST's. ---- pruhdlr DSC01034.JPG
     
  9. ZenArchery

    ZenArchery LSB Active Member SUS VENATOR CLUB LoneStarBoars Supporter

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    Old school Pulsar Apex XD50a best group I shot was .221 shooting prone at 100 yds. Zoomed in 4x.
     
  10. diggler1833

    diggler1833 LSB Member

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    Haven't read the other responses yet, but one thing that I noticed was just how much the reticle moves with your cheek weld if it is in different places. Since I'm a relative newby to the thermal game, I am sure that I am missing the correct terminology. However in the scoped rifle game we attribute it to parallax.

    I would have sworn that the eyebox was not critical with looking at a screen (something like a parallax free holographic sight). But darned if i didn't notice it with my Trail XQ38 when I had it in a rest for a re-zero. **I'm sure that the difference in body position as it relates to recoil (bench to kneeling in the field) may have aided this***

    Maybe I'm crazy, but it has caused me to be super conscious of my shooting position.

    YMMV
     
  11. wigwamitus

    wigwamitus LSB Active Member

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    I try to get in the center of the handwarmer ... the left side is the first group, then 3 groups on the right side, final group in the center of the handwarmer.

    [​IMG]

    Hunting + Thermals is not long distance precision ... or not even dot drills at 100yds ... hitting a hog in the center of the neck from 100yds ... say of 4 inch circle is 4 MOA territory ... not 0.4 MOA territory :)

    For me, I'm usually going after opossum, coons or yotes inside 200yds around the chicken coop or the cattle ... and typically that's 3-4 MOA for a kill.
     
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  12. Mattg1500

    Mattg1500 LSB Member

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    Thanks all for the info!
     
  13. Brian Shaffer

    Brian Shaffer Pro Staff Third Coast Thermal SUS VENATOR CLUB LoneStarBoars Supporter

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    Your eye position does not matter relative to zero because your eyes don't actually see the target. They see an image of the target displayed on a tiny screen. If you see the crosshairs moving as you change your cheek weld, it is an optical artifact between the tiny display and the ocular lens. Keep in mind that both the target you are sighting and the crosshairs all appear on the same plane in the display. So the crosshairs will not change in relative position to the target based on your cheek weld.
     
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