IR Hunter MarkII to date

[Brian Shaffer]

This is a possibility, or it could be the DVR setting or something.

If Dave ABQ's observation is correct, then it would seem unlikely that MKII users are all having DVR deficit issues.

An iPhone held up to the scope is certainly far from an ideal recording setup, but look how drastically better the video gets doing just that at 3:15 in this video. Live in person, it looks much better than the even the iphone part, so that is the upside.

They all look better in person, LOL. Holding a video camera or iPhone up to the scope for shooting video during a hunt isn't far from an ideal setup, it is downright cumbersome and often quite detrimental.

Aren't those videos relative ?

If the DVR limits what you actually see as a YouTube video aren't the limiting factors the same regardless of the brand of thermal device?

Thanks

No. GIGO still applies. The DVR will not upgrade the imagery so is garbage goes in, garbage will go out. In other words, it won't make up for a deficit signal, though it will downgrade a quality signal.

So the question is, is the video out of lesser quality on the MKII or not?

Not IR Defense or MKII-related, but in the ongoing safa of the ATN X-sight, we have seen how the video out signal can be manipulated significantly by the firmware such that in the X-sight's case, sometimes the video out signal is actually superior to what is being seen through the scope and sometimes it has been inferior, depending on the firmware upgrade.

 

[OdDuMet]

Aren't those videos relative ?

If the DVR limits what you actually see as a YouTube video aren't the limiting factors the same regardless of the brand of thermal device?

Thanks

That does seem likely at this point, (EDIT to clarify: meaning the issue is probably something to do with the MK2 video out) but like I said, I really dont know. Digital DVR's run compression algorithms, that could possibly play differently with different sources, or maybe not. Video and digital DVR's are not something I know that much about. I do know the output is RS-170 which is the black & white TV standard dating back to the 50's or 60's, but I've seen that output format listed on lots of other thermals. It's an interlaced (every other line per refresh, i.e. half the full image) and it is not 640 lines. That explains some of it, especially why the image through any thermal I've looked through always looks better through the eyepiece, but not all of what I see in that video, based on video I've seen from other thermal scopes using RS-170, (which I think is pretty much all of them).

When I get a DVR I'll play with it and call IRD. Personally I'm not too concerned with video out quality. If I was making thermal scopes I would be though, since most people are going to judge and make buying decisions based off what they see on youtube. For that reason, if it has issues and they can fix it with a firmware update, I bet they will.

 

[JPK]

The 35mm, 60mm, etc specs above are focal length. The F-number (F-Stop/F-Ratio) is lens diamter/focal length. This will give you an idea of how "bright" a lens is. Basically a larger diamter lens with the same focal length will gather more "light" than a smaller diameter lens with the same focal length. I dont see the lens diameter very often in specs on thermals, but the F-number is sometimes given.

According to the specs on Armasightstore.com, the focal length and the diameter are the same for the Apollo's. F-number is the same for all of them. Here is a link to the specs on the 100mm, and you can see focal length is given at 100mm and "entrance pupil" is given as 100. F-number is given as 1:1. (the link isn't sticking, but you can go to armasightstore.com, click on thermal device, select clip ons and take a look at the specs for the 640 Apollo Pro 50mm and 100mm as well as themApollo 48mm.

JPK

 

[OdDuMet]

I saw that, and that is an excellent spec. I think "Thermal Sensitivity" and the F-number (Lens size/focal length) would prob be the two main specs to look at for poor condition performance.

 

[DaveABQ]

That does seem likely at this point, (EDIT to clarify: meaning the issue is probably something to do with the MK2 video out) but like I said, I really dont know. Digital DVR's run compression algorithms, that could possibly play differently with different sources, or maybe not. Video and digital DVR's are not something I know that much about. I do know the output is RS-170 which is the black & white TV standard dating back to the 50's or 60's, but I've seen that output format listed on lots of other thermals. It's an interlaced (every other line per refresh, i.e. half the full image) and it is not 640 lines. That explains some of it, especially why the image through any thermal I've looked through always looks better through the eyepiece, but not all of what I see in that video, based on video I've seen from other thermal scopes using RS-170, (which I think is pretty much all of them).

When I get a DVR I'll play with it and call IRD. Personally I'm not too concerned with video out quality. If I was making thermal scopes I would be though, since most people are going to judge and make buying decisions based off what they see on youtube. For that reason, if it has issues and they can fix it with a firmware update, I bet they will.

The DVR isn't the limiting factor, I haven't seen any DVR's in the last few years that can't handle at least D1 analog signals, 720x480 (NTSC), therefore the signal should match the video output of the scope, as none can go above this being analog. Well there is one standard above it, 960H, but more used in CCTV's than anything. But I will say that not all DVR's, even handling the same resolution, will look the same.

We all know that looking through the scope generally looks better than the video recorded via the DVR. When looking through the scope you are looking at an LCD display, the resolution of the display is a factor in the image viewed by the output of the core. This image can be different than the video output, depending on the resolution of the LCD and whether it is an OLED or another form factor that may intensify viewing.

IRD will not be able to change the video output with a firmware update, they are outputting max what is possible (I'm assuming here) via whatever video processing they are using for the video output, but it would be good to know what resolution each are putting out if it is D1, 4CIF, 2CIF, CIF or what. Unless you are talking about other adjustments such as contrast, etc.?

I will say, detail is good with the Mark II, as TLM said above, it is a scope I would consider, I was only making a point that the detail in the sense of temperature ranges seemed less on live animals such as hogs as compared to FLIR type cores, etc. And my point being, I didn't know why, only what I observed. Could be user settings, seems that brightness/contrast settings may have been an issue, dunno.

 

[rgilbert]

One thing I notice it seems in most of the videos on YouTube of the mark ii is that the detail of the animal or other objects doesn't show the temperature range difference detail.

A hog in black hot is all black vs other cores where they show the hotter and colder parts of the hog like if it was in mud or water. Maybe I haven't watched enough videos lol.

I've noticed this in most of the video I have shot. The last video of the hog and cows was with a different MKII and I can see the hair down the hogs back that is not as hot.

 

[DaveABQ]

It could just be there isn't much video of the Mark II out there yet and a lot of people shoot in white hot, which may be harder to discern.

Hogs that haven't been in mud or water also look mostly the same temperature.

I do like the menu setup of the scope. Wish someone would post up a video of the menus and explain the functions, guess I could read the manual also lol.

 

[rgilbert]

It could just be there isn't much video of the Mark II out there yet and a lot of people shoot in white hot, which may be harder to discern.

Hogs that haven't been in mud or water also look mostly the same temperature.

I do like the menu setup of the scope. Wish someone would post up a video of the menus and explain the functions, guess I could read the manual also lol.

I will try and get that on here for you. I keep thinking everyone has tried it and have not been thinking about a good review. Thanks for reminding me Dave.

 

[DaveABQ]

That would be good as I haven't seen any videos like that. Showing different settings on an object, crosshairs, adjustments and maybe even some pictures of the scope and controls/buttons, etc

 

[Terry]

I had the chance to demo a MK II 35mm scope earlier this year when buying another thermal scope for myself. The image clarity was a 10+ and the image really showed small differences in heat in animals even more than the THOR 640 2.5X I ended up buying. That said I passed on the MK II for now waiting for firmware updates from a few glitches I noticed out in the field. Also I've yet to see any thermal scope video that looks as good as it really does to your eyes in person.

 

[DaveABQ]

Thanks Terry. I think they only time we'll see video output as good is when they go digital, if that's possible.

 

[rgilbert]

That would be good as I haven't seen any videos like that. Showing different settings on an object, crosshairs, adjustments and maybe even some pictures of the scope and controls/buttons, etc

Tell me what you want to see and I WILL try to post it up here. I was going to look at something. Hell I don't know empty pasture, etc. I'll try to see if my horses will cooperate. If not the dogs are next up. LOL

 

[FrankT]

Naked women!

 

[RattlesnakeDan]

Naked women!

Frank has been talking about Hillary a lot lately, probably thinking about her again. lo

 

[FrankT]

you dog you..I want to throw up everytime I hear or see the *itch!

 

[RattlesnakeDan]

Sorry, couldn't resist.

 

[OdDuMet]

Im hunting again tonight. Ill have some more detailed info later in the week, but here are a few quickies.

After my first full night with it in familiar terrain, i cant stand looking through my FLIR HS-307 65mm 320x240 unit any more. Its like the difference b/t a tube tv with rabbit ears and HD TV w/ Blue Ray.

90% humidity last night. My son switched to the older FLIR 307 and said "Dad i think there is something wrong with this thermal. I cant see the treeline."

Also, my recognition skills will have to be adjusted. I'm not used to seeeing ears on coons at 75yds. I thought it was a fox or at yote based on prior experience.

I had some of the glitches ive heard mentioned for the first time today. I remembered the batteries were the same ones from last night and i never turned it off for about 4 hours. New batteries and all was perfect again.

Word from IRD is that low batteries and spinning the knobs really fast are the cause. So far that has been my experience. 2 hunts over 3-4 weeks.