6.Something

[ZenArchery]

Stripped lower needs a friend (maybe).

Since I can't afford an AR-10 in the near future. Figured I'd play around with some of y'all's favorite cal's.
Read up on the 6.5 & 6.8 debate. Can't honestly decide between the two. For a hog gun at night I'm never gonna push over 125/150 yards (to be honest most of my shots are under 60 yards). Convince me that at that distance one caliber out perform the other.

I do like options in bullets. Seem to find more options for 6.8 then the 6.5. But if I go 6.8 I'd have to invest in new powder. I have a lot of powder for the 6.5.

The main thing I want in my next hog gun is light weight. 6.5 seems to be very limited in barrel length and twist. 6.8 is all over the place in both categories. I've seen barrels as short as 8" and as long as 20+" with many twist options.

So here is my question. Trying to build a light weight 6.something, remembering I won't shoot a hog at night over 150 yards, I will most likely use a 120ish gr. bullet, and I'm not going to suppress; please answer the following questions:
a). What caliber? Why?
b). What is minimal barrel length?
c). What barrel twist?

Tell me what your decision factors where in choosing your 6.something?
What do you like most and not like about your 6.something?

 

[FrankT]

For 150 and less I use my 6.8 8.5" Bison barrel on a pistol lower and an SBX on a KAK tube and prefer the SSA 110TSX or a handloaded 120SST. The 6.8 is optimized in a 16" barrel good to 250/300 so I use my 16" scout *** barrel it is a sub MOA rifle w factory ammo... it shoots all ammo very well. Remember *** is the fastest barrel at each specific length as compared to other mfg's.

 

[Curly Shuffle]

Either way you will not go wrong, you can get barrel lengths in either model. Shorter ones in the 6.8 seem to be more common than the 6.5 but can be found. Both are very nice rifles and both will kill a hog and that is the bottom line. 6.8 Good!! 6.5 Good!! and both go BANG BANG!!!

 

[Afalex1]

The 6.8 has a larger bullet selection and is designed for shorter barrels. The 6.5 gives up a little fps more than the 6.8 as the barrel length decreases. Light weight means a 16" or less barrel with a thinner profile. The 6.8 will do better in a setup like that.

 

[Hogdaddy]

I've got a TC G2 in 6.8 with 14" bull barrel that's a tack driver and Mega AR in 6.8 - both are great. Got the 18" barrel from ************** - great info http://ar15performance.com/

 

[DaveABQ]

Is your main goal to use for hunting? If so, the 6.8, there is a much greater range of bullets for hunting for the .277".

Either will get the job done, the 6.8 can shoot the same weight bullet at a higher velocity.

If you do decide on the 6.5, do not get a Grendel. I had 2 of them, sold them both, I now have two .264 LBC's. The Grendel has a .300" neck, too loose in my opinion for shooting accurately, IMO opinion it was designed that way for full auto fire when it was being proposed to the military. The *** barrels have a .297 neck, the LBC's have a .295" neck. Now, the *** is a mix between the two, so he doesn't designate as either, but a .264/6.5 Grendel.

There is also a chamber sight design on the throat for the .264's vs the Grendel, much better on the .264 IMO. (edit/update, H from *** can explain the compound throat of the 6.5G vs freebore better than me).

Of course, *** also makes the Six5, which is a 6.8 case neck down to 6.5, so you get the case capacity of the 6.8 with the higher BC bullet choice of the 6.5. The 6.5 has a better choice of bullets for long range, target.

If you don't reload, the 6.8 is also the way to go for ammunition, a great selection, mostly better prices, etc.

 

[DaveABQ]

Also Ed, don't believe everything you read. Like one of the statements above about the *** barrel being faster than other manufacturers barrels of the same length. That is an inaccurate statement as it doesn't take in to account twist rate, barrel rifling such as 3R, 4R, 5R, 6R or others and if the land to groove ratio is even, also cut rifled vs button rifled and what type of button rifling such as polygonal, etc.

As you know twist rate is optimized for bullet profiles and weights. I didn't say what I thought the optimal twist rate is, because it depends on what your needs are.

Same for barrel length, what do you want it for, what range? I like 16" barrels for hog and deer hunting in Texas, but here in New Mexico deer are long shots, I like the longer barrels to get the extra velocity vs the same spec'd barrel of a shorter length.

 

[FrankT]

From ***, maybe Harrison will speak to this.

"We have designed a 5 groove hybrid rifling similar to 5R with a low land to groove ratio to increase the bore area and lessen bullet deformation which leads to better accuracy. We have found that our 5R Melonite QPQ barrels consistently produce 60-90fps more than most SPCII 10 and 11 twist 4 groove barrels with the same loads."

 

[DaveABQ]

That doesn't say anything other than the comparison to those specs, there is much more to it than that, so to make the statement that *** barrels are faster than other manufacturers of the same length is completely false. And as your quote above 'most'. Harrison is also looking at going to 3R barrels for obvious reasons. You didn't post what H said, just that it is faster than all others.

If you want to take all the manufacturers barrels, different rifling, different twist rates, button vs cut, polygonal button vs others ,etc and do a test and post it here, than I'll believe it. But there is such a wide range of variables that making the statement you made is misleading. Quoting someone else without the facts is misleading and inaccurate. Show me the numbers?

 

[FrankT]

not going to discuss it w you Dave, do your juvenile arguing w someone else.

 

[DaveABQ]

'as my saying goes, "don't take it personal, don't make it personal"', posting what you 'heard' or 'read', is one thing, going by facts is another, misleading people by what you think you know is one thing again vs what you actually know.

 

[Brian Shaffer]

I went with 6.5 Grendel simply because of the higher sectional density promises more penetration (everything else held the same). However, I haven't read about the 6.8 having penetration problems. The 6.5 has a better BC, but that isn't really going to yield you any real benefits at typical hunting distances. IIRC, it starts to matter somewhere beyond 400 yards, enough to where you notice. There are more choices in ammo, bullets, and manufacturers if you go with 6.8, but I am not about to trade in my 6.5. Both are good.

 

[DaveABQ]

True Brian, both are pretty good, and close to similar results, the 6.5/.264 better for long range and realistically even though there are more hunting bullet choices for the 6.8, its not like we change bullets every day, we usually settle on one and it performs, like your SST's in the 6.5 and mine in the 6.8. Although I probably experiment more than most and SPS has a sale on the new Nosler 90gr bonded performance for the 6.8. Nosler sells them for $46/100 and SPS has the Nosler overruns for $20/100, so figured I would give them a try as I like the 64gr bonded out of the .223/5.56.

 

[TEXASLAWMAN]

Both are good the 6.8 in my opinion is growing faster and is already mainstream.

 

[Ratdog68]

I opted for the 6.8 during the earlier stages of both calibers. I didn't care for the "you can only buy it from me" choice early on with the Grendel. The attitude of many of their enthusiasts also turned me off (back then). The two calibers have progressed over the years, and perform much closer to one another than many will like to admit to. Within the 6.8, much of the less desirable pieces of hardware (SAAMI chamber, 6-groove Enfield rifling ,etc.) have been identified and less and less vendors are using those types of specs. Knowing your vendor's product (specs) is key. Other than choosing a rate of twist for a weight class of bullet chosen, the rate isn't as important as type of rifling and the land to groove ratio and chamber offered. By default, "MOST" 1:10 (6.8 barrels) are just a re-chambered .270 tube, and often have the 6-groove Enfield rifling... so they get no love by many.

I'm a huge fan of AR15Performance barrels. His chambers are more like the .223 Wylde (in the .223 Remington/5.56 NATO scheme of things), a good mix of good accuracy, and ability to utilize warmer loads. The good land to groove ratio for the rifling, and accuracy I get from his product has kept me returning for additional product. I get sub .5" six-shot groupings at 100 yds from a bi-pod on a bench.

I'm also happy with my caliber choice because of the bullet selection, and choices for factory ammo made available.

The 6.8 performs well from shorter barrels, I'm very pleased with my 16" carbine, and am enjoying the 8.5" pistol I built also (still tweaking on it). My pistol is a Bison Armory barrel. Bison also offers their "BSP" line, a 1:7 twist... developed for the 200gr Woodleigh sub-sonic loadings that Ben settled on. Reports are it shoots super-sonic loadings fine too.

Know what you want to buy/why, bone up on the specs offered, and find a vendor you trust. I prefer buying from supporting vendors of the forums... the service is more personalized, and the follow-up service is generally there as well (if needed).

 

[Curly Shuffle]

Supporting on the forum is why I went with Eric at BSA also. I let my daughter make her own decision about her own rifle, she has been around guns since birth and she knows my 2 Grendels and I had a 6.8 but never did like it for some reason, I could not get the feel for it. So the daughter went with the 6.8 in the 16 inch and she loves it and the more she lets me shoot it the more I like it also. I like the 6.5, and the 6.8 now, and would not turn down either one of them. They both do the job when it comes to shooting hogs and deer and do it very good and critters wide up not breathing very well at the end. They are both fine rifles. BANG BANG!!

 

[DaveABQ]

The 6.8 performs well from shorter barrels, I'm very pleased with my 16" carbine, and am enjoying the 8.5" pistol I built also (still tweaking on it). My pistol is a Bison Armory barrel. Bison also offers their "BSP" line, a 1:7 twist... developed for the 200gr Woodleigh sub-sonic loadings that Ben settled on. Reports are it shoots super-sonic loadings fine too.

I have the BSP. Need to get out and do some more shooting with it. Here in NM I had to go up to around 15gr of 4895 to get over 1000 fps vs Ben's 14.3 grs where he lives. Granted, the 200 Woodleighs don't expand well, but they tumble well on impact and should work well on a neck shot on a hog.

I sold my 8.5" Bison, don't want to shoot with a suppressor and its frickin loud without and a flamethrower lol.

 

[ZenArchery]

Doing more research this weekend. Seems like 6.8 has more options for what I am looking for in light weight. Just realized you can't use a standard lower. So I would have to start from scratch (which was not part of the plan). May be selling a bunch of stuff first to upgrade my current N.V. It still works fine but wanting a forward attachment type so I can swap on different scopes. Great info. though.

 

[FrankT]

yes the 6.8 uses a standard lower only the LWRC Six8 does not. Barrel, bolt mags and ammo, all the rest is standard.

 

[Curly Shuffle]

yes the 6.8 uses a standard lower only the LWRC Six8 does not. Barrel, bolt mags and ammo, all the rest is standard.

What he said, Same lower for 556, 223, 300, 6.5, 6.8 all them from one lower. BANG BANG!!